Crampon Classes

[tinaballina]

Have fun out there. Hey, and who knew Crampons would be such a hot topic?

z[/quote]

LMAO

[Ken]

Tina, this is a weightier topic than one might imagine. I've given the talk the last few years at the gathering of the people about to hike the PCT from Mexico to Canada, on snow travel. Ice axe and crampons are the major issue, every time. Every year, I worry about the advice I give people, and I talk a lot with my professional guide friends about the best thing to do and say.

Think of crampons as a series of sharpened knives on the bottom of your foot. Most people with some experience, have sliced up some pants! They are heavy, and the biggest problem that I see, is that they will allow one to get oneself into a much more dangerous situation, than one could without them. If one is venturing off of relatively flat snow/ice covered trails, one MUST have an ice axe, know how to use it, have practiced with it a lot, and have it at the ready to use.

This sort of usage is technical, and most people would be VERY well advised to get professional instruction in their usage. Some mention Sierra Mountaineering International, and I recommend their snow travel course highly. You will really understand the issues and the use after that.

Walking on a trail that is not high angled is, I think, a different animal, where the real issue is slipperiness. For this, I think that any of these other devices work fine, and avoid the danger of the crampon spikes. I have used instep crampons or yax trax type of traction devices in such situation, with success----and I think that is what they were designed for.

While I think that aluminum crampons work fine for SoCal non-technical usage, I think that even those are more than what you need for what you are describing your usage would be, and you would avoid the expense, weight, and potential danger of full crampons. You can always upgrade, but you will always have with you the most important tool: judgement....which should keep you away from dangerous situations.

[ferrisjrf]

Hey, check these out.

http://www.kahtoola.com/microspikes.html

They're not so pricey, and look like they're light and convenient. I like my crampons, but I'll probably replace them with these when they wear out. I think these would suffice for most of what I've seen in these mountains.

z

I never used anything except crampons and snowshoes while living in CA, but since moving to the east coast a couple years ago, I've used a variety of different lesser "traction devices" for the mixed terrain you get in the mountains of the northeast.

Anyway, the standard here for a long time (when you don't actually need crampons) has been Stabilicers Pro. These Microspikes, however, have become really popular here in the past few months. They're still pretty new, so I'm not sure how they'll hold up over time, but they're absolutely ideal for hard packed snow and most ice. They're really light, easy to take on & off, and pack small. If you're not doing anything too technical or exposed, I definitely recommend them. BUT, they're definitely not a replacement for crampons. Nothing can replace a set of 10 or 12 point steel crampons, if conditions call for them.

Jason

[tinaballina]

Let me ask you all this, if i were to do Baldy and/or San J. in two weeks, given the current conditions, what would you use?
open to anyone....

[zippetydude]

A helicopter.

z

[KathyW]

Tina: Be careful out there - As other have said, if you find yourself on steep terrain that requires crampon use you should also be using an ice axe and have practiced self arrest. Crampons aren't as easy to use as one might think - many accidents happen when they are used incorrectly. An ice axe is also not much good if you don't know how to use it.

A few years back after I had been wandering around a little in the snow, I took a snow skills class with Sierra Mountain Center. It was just a day long class, but the teacher/guide kept us out there for 12 hours practicing snow travel skills - it was a really good class and I learned a lot of basics to take with me and practice.

http://www.sierramountaincenter.com/summer_snow_skills.html

There are a number of places where you can take a class on snow travel skills or you might be able to hook up with someone who is willing to take you along and teach you.

I still have lots to learn and practice - I'm fairly new to mountaineering. One of my biggest worries is that I'll fall and not be able to arrest the fall - I've seen how bad it can be when that happens.

Kathy

[beastie]

Hi Tinaballina,

Crampon classes truly are not necessary; instructions are included. It may take you a few times to get comfortable putting them on and off but once broken in it’s a cinch. As far as aluminum vs. steel, if you are going to use them occasionally aluminum is fine. If you think that you may utilize them regularly and on very rock surfaces then consider the steel. I have a pair by Stubai Ultralight Universal Crampons and they are light and ideal. They are not very expensive and they fit just about every type of shoe. They truly can be worn over sandals. Suggestion, purchase crampons with at least 10-points.

The Stubai crampons, http://www.greatoutdoorsdepot.com/stuba ... mpons.html

[KathyW]

It's not how to put them on and take them off that people typically need instructions for.

[asabat]

It's not how to put them on and take them off that people typically need instructions for.

One important rule - no crampons during glissades. Catching a point and going end over end down a steep hill is not a good way to stay alive.

[Hikin_Jim]

Crampon classes truly are not necessary

With all due respect, that's about the worst advice I've ever seen on this board. If someone is in terrain where crampons* are needed, they darned well better know more than what it says on the label.

If nothing else, one needs to know how to use an ice axe and crampons in conjunction with one another. How to prepare for, navigate in, and travel in winter conditions is also really important.

Crampons alone can seriously hurt you. Lose your balance while in motion and you've just driven a steel spike into the back of your calf. Now try walking out.

If you're going through trerrain with exposure, get properly trained or, and I'm serious about this, go hike somewhere else. I'm really not trying to be mean. I've had to bail on hikes where I knew I was in over my head due to snow turning to basically ice. I also know, well, actually, used to know, someone who didn't make that decision. He's no longer with us.

I'm really serious. DO NOT buy a pair of crampons, read the instructions on the box, and go off traipsing through serious winter terrain.

HJ

*Now if you're just looking for a little extra traction, grab some yak trax or the like and off you go.