Fluorescent Orange Dots...too much for one person

[guest]

Hi,
Regardless of opinions about trail markings, when a person places these off trail, in areas that will surely fatigue climbers a lot more than staying on the main route, with obnoxious florescent orange, it's doing a big disservice to the rest, (i.e.repeated rescues several times a yr. on Skyline).
Not to mention large round circles, foot long arrows, 2M markings, 6 or more spots on the same rock, you get the idea, this person could care less about the trail or other trail users.

It may also lead to others getting momentarily lost, or at least wasting time re-locating the main trail, and in sensitive areas contributing to advanced erosion.
If people are not familiar with a trail (or route in this case), there's many ways to educate oneself, or find someone who knows it & learn.

ss

[cynthia23]

I'm afraid Ken, I still can't agree with you--not only do I not think I'm a jerk for objecting strongly to spray-painted graffiti on trails , I really can't see anything 'interesting' or 'diverse' about such actions. Some things are just bad. btw, I wonder if you've actually seen the orange dots. I went up to about 2000 feet on Saturday and got my first glimpse of the damage. They're utterly horrible and I can't imagine anyone who had a visual on them still defending this a-hole.

[Hikin_Jim]

I think Ken may have been saying that some painted markings in some circumstances in some areas may be appropriate. I didn't get the sense that he was speaking about these specific markings that someone recently put on Skyline.

Speaking of the specific markings on Skyline: Now that's rich. You go out to mark a trail and get it wrong? What a complete idiot. If you're going to mark a trail, um, maybe you should know where the trail is before you mark it. More brains, less spray paint, please.

HJ

[scotts]

Scott,

If you find yourself with an opinion, do let us know.

HJ

Equanimity and S/N ratio suffering with lack of outside time.

My next post really needs to be a TR.

[MikeB]

You all are right, trails are blazed more extensively in the east, but often with good reason. How extensively to blaze a trail is a tough tradeoff between unobtrusiveness and safety, and the obvious LNT benefits of keeping people on the maintained trail.

In defense of Mount Monadnock's blazing scheme: although it is not the highest peak in NH, it is the most hiked mountain in the Western Hemisphere -- something like 125,000 people hike it a year, mostly in the summer. On a summer or fall weekend expect over a thousand people to summit EACH DAY. Many of these folks, as you would imagine, are not experienced hikers -- lots of Boston suburbanites. The trails are extensively and clearly blazed in order to allow non-wilderness types to safely enjoy a mountain experience and appreciate the wilderness. Blazes are a better alternative than a road, for sure! Those looking for a more pristine wilderness experience go north to the White Mts, which are also blazed, but less aggressively. Use of cairns is more common there particularly above treeline. I've always thought the line of cairns with white quartz tops marching off into the distance across the Presidentials was beautiful......functional too, particularly in the frequent whiteout conditions.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... =3&theater


I'm in violent agreement with everybody's point that on a trail like Skyline, flourescent paint is never appropriate. I don't know if I was oblivious, or if it was done very recently, but I didn't see any of it last Wednesday when I hiked Skyline. Just the white dots and numbered switchbacks on the lower part of the trail from Ramon Rd.

Good luck to all of you doing God's work eliminating these obnoxious markings......

[Ken]

I'm afraid Ken, I still can't agree with you--not only do I not think I'm a jerk for objecting strongly to spray-painted graffiti on trails , I really can't see anything 'interesting' or 'diverse' about such actions. Some things are just bad. btw, I wonder if you've actually seen the orange dots. I went up to about 2000 feet on Saturday and got my first glimpse of the damage. They're utterly horrible and I can't imagine anyone who had a visual on them still defending this a-hole.

Disagree with WHAT?????

I am not advocating ANYTHING!

I am simply commenting on how things are done differently by different people, WITHOUT any commentary on what is good, or bad.

I already posted that I oppose such trail marking, so if you disagree with me, then that means you are the one out there with your spray can, meaning you are the biggest a-hole in the world.

[Hikin_Jim]

It's unanimous: spray paint on Skyline sucks. So, relax everyone.

HJ

[cynthia23]

I think I'm gonna let your interesting post speak for itself, Ken.

[Ken]

I think Ken may have been saying that some painted markings in some circumstances in some areas may be appropriate. I didn't get the sense that he was speaking about these specific markings that someone recently put on Skyline.


HJ

Not so, Jim (although I appreciate your civil tone and attempt to understand)

Personally, I'd find it hard to justify painting under any circumstances---it would have to involve very serious safety issues, if even that, as I would expect that there are more environmentally appropriate ways to mark, when marking is absolutely positively necessary....AND I'd expect it to require significant public input BEFORE being done.

I have no clue as to whether such things were undertaken back east, and I doubt that I'll ever hike the mountain again.

I DO think that the people who are actually involved in using a particular resource should be involved in the decision making for that resource.

Inasmuch as few if any of the posters here would be considered "regular users" of the eastern mountains, I'm not sure that our opinions should carry much weight as to what they do there. Just as, I'm not particularly happy with the thought of New Hampshire climbers getting heavily involved in decisions on our local mountains (with their dots and crosses)

[lilbitmo]

I understand that there are regional differences. I know blazes of various types are very common back east. And of course there are differences of opinion in every location.

There are some forest of such density in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan that without those "blazes" even with a GPS and Map and Compass you would have a very difficult time finding your way, it's dark from the canopy in the middle of a sunny day. The difference there is they have a significant amount of healthy trees, those blazes are hammered into the trees at a height that can be seen in snow or non snow conditions, they have multiple colors as some trails share the same route or single colors that you can look up in trail guide books for easy identification. This is done by the agency in charge of each location either state of Federal depending on the location.

I get why they do it back there, and I get why they did it on Christmas Tree hill in the San Gorgonio wilderness, I just don't understand why anyone wants to deface the beauty of our local mountains when trail finding (with the lack of density and easy land marks already available if one just takes a good look around) here is just not that difficult. I'm the kind of guy that if I find someone doing that, they are going to be easily identifiable, they will be the person riding the tram down with Orange and White dots on their face just saying