Taking the tram Sunday

[hvydrt]

i don't know all the details, but Perry didn't want a bunch of people from the tram going to that lake. I think if the area is that sensitive the Park Service would just put up some signs saying the area is closed. The map I linked to is the first map that comes up when you do a google search for "san jacinto from tram", its from localhikes.com, so I imagine most people see that map anyways.

[KathyW]

I thought maybe it was the old trail from Tamarack Valley that was the issue, but I guess I was wrong.

[phydeux]

i don't know all the details, but Perry didn't want a bunch of people from the tram going to that lake. I think if the area is that sensitive the Park Service would just put up some signs saying the area is closed. The map I linked to is the first map that comes up when you do a google search for "san jacinto from tram", its from localhikes.com, so I imagine most people see that map anyways.

This might help. Over 20 years ago the State Park Service experienced a lot of problems with people going back to the "sensitive area", leaving trash and sometimes getting lost, and mid-winter tram visitors would try to get back there with no winter hiking gear. The problems were somewhat similar to todays problems on C2C. As a result the CA Park Service repositioned the trail away from the area and the maps the state distributed had the area deleted to keep it from becoming an attractive nuisance. The area isn't easily visible from the trail, but if you know where it is you can get there.

[IgoslowUgoaround]

ohhhhhh...

[Perry]

Phydeux, do you think it's mainly for safety or ecological reasons? I really don't like limiting conversations here because I strongly believe in free speech, but at the same time I don't want this message board to cause damage to this area given its proximity to the tram. This would make a good discussion in the Feedback section of the site. I'm curious what everyone's thoughts and opinions are... I have wondered about the other area too, if that trail was removed for safety reasons instead of ecological. If that's the case, my opinion would be that it's an over-reaction to a small problem.

[Hikin_Jim]

And it is definitely environmentally sensitive. Not a good place to have a lot of people going to, especially tourons.

[Perry]

"tourons" is right!

[KathyW]

okay

I didn't make it up the tram this morning - I started feeling poorly last night and just couldn't get out of be early enough this morning. When I finally got going I just did a jog/walk up to Morton Peak from Hwy 38 - I moved much slower than I had on Friday though.

[phydeux]

Phydeux, do you think it's mainly for safety or ecological reasons? I really don't like limiting conversations here because I strongly believe in free speech, but at the same time I don't want this message board to cause damage to this area given its proximity to the tram. This would make a good discussion in the Feedback section of the site. I'm curious what everyone's thoughts and opinions are... I have wondered about the other area too, if that trail was removed for safety reasons instead of ecological. If that's the case, my opinion would be that it's an over-reaction to a small problem.

I believe it was some of both. Trash in the wilderness was a bigger problem back then than it is today, and created a periodic scheduling of clean-ups by the park service, plus persons would trample all over the area. But I believe safety was a REAL concern, especially in the winter; imagine a tram visitor with tennis shoes, jeans, and a light jacket making a spur-of-the-moment decision to walk back there in either snow, or on compressed, icy snow, or even on the ice that's back there - a recipe for disaster. The resulting rescue would create an immediate problem, not a scheduled clean-up activity, and drain resources pretty quickly.

My 2 cents: I'm not for limiting speech either, but leaving this area "under the radar" on the BB is probably a good idea. If someone goes to the extent of getting a USGS map (or a GPS map) they are probably resonable proficient in taking care of themselves in the backcountry. And if they see it on the map, and go exploring for it, they can have the joy of discovering it themselves. You might want to ask the State Park Service for some input, too. I'll bet they'd want it kept off the BB to limit the drain on resources the area's noteriety will create, especially in winter.

[IgoslowUgoaround]

okay

I didn't make it up the tram this morning - I started feeling poorly last night and just couldn't get out of be early enough this morning. When I finally got going I just did a jog/walk up to Morton Peak from Hwy 38 - I moved much slower than I had on Friday though.

missed ya... my friend DID make it though so i wasn't alone to the peak... hope you feel better kathy
-waves-