Ascent Records

[zippetydude]

This is the most constructive thread I've seen on the subject. I'd only like to add 4 of observations.

1) All people, not just ultra runners, tend to choose the most efficient route. That's just how it is. Nicely, that doesn't always conflict with effots to avoid erosion, etc.

2) Because of that, trails have a tendency to consolidate into a single trail. This mostly (though not always) results in less erosion because the overall number of trails tends to slowly reduce from multiple experimantal routes into one or two primary functional routes.

3) The great guys who love this trail so much and are willing to accept blame for the changes are not, in fact, the real culprits. The trail, because it is so interesting, varied, and blessed with a tram to get back down, was ultimately going to attract more and more travelers. This sudden, large influx of new hikers/runners is the true cause of the braided trails seen here and there.

4) I had taken a break from April til this December from doing Skyline. What I observed last Saturday was that the number of trails is actually decreasing back towards a general concensus of 1 or 2 trails. This is good, and I hope it ends up as just a single, efficient trail that just about everyone seems to be happy with.

By the way, one minor point to consider as well. It is my belief that the majority of travelers on Skyline are not necessarily posting or even lurking on this site. As was mentioned earlier, there is no governing body that "runs" Skyline. That means that only the efforts by us regulars to help the trail stay in a sustainable state will ultimately have the impact everyone is hoping for. If the old route is no longer traveled and a new, non-erosive alternative seems to be the new primary route, why not throw our efforts in with that route and try to make it functional, sustainable, and the first choice so that people aren't faced with the confusing choice of 5 separate braids to the trail?

Just some thoughts. Nice, productive thread.

BTW, I think that the FKT will ultimately end up following a simple, direct, fairly steep route that almost everyone seems to be choosing already. Given that, if you start at the notch in the wall at the museum and top out at Grubb's Notch (not the tram door) and have a great time while doing no further damage, congrats to you. I don't go for FKT because PR is the only thing I have a shot at, but I occasionally go as fast as I can just for the sheer joy of it. I don't judge anyone else who does the same thing.

z

[Zé]

get a GPS watch and be done with it.

[bdog]

I snuck in another skyline ascent yesterday before the storm hit. I now think the route variations have a relatively little effect. For the run yesterday, probably less than 45 seconds. So it matters little I think. Here's a link to the trip report with the results.

http://fastestknowntime.proboards.com/i ... =49&page=2

[drndr]

I get a pebble in my shoe and I have to stop and take it out.

Combining thoughts on your TR and Hiking Jims. You obviously do some crazy running/ dayhikes. Where would you rank Skyline and C2C in the country's toughest dayhikes?

Dan

[physicslord]

Good for you Bdog.
What I like about Brett is his willingness to tough things out. It's like the FKT philosophy is the opposite of "be prepared". If any little thing were to go wrong you will be completely miserable.

One thing that drives me crazy is the people who practice ultra light backpacking. Then all up and down the trail these fools are begging me for food because they didn't bring enough. Don't get me wrong. I don't mind lending a hand to someone in an emergency, but just because you wanted to hike light, and didn't bring enough food. That isn't my problem.

[Hikin_Jim]

One thing that drives me crazy is the people who practice ultra light backpacking. Then all up and down the trail these fools are begging me for food because they didn't bring enough.

I believe that's what they call "stupid light" -- light weight beyond the point where it makes sense. Might I suggest that bringing enough to eat is pretty basic?

HJ

[bdog]

drndr,

as far as ascents up single mountains skyline/c2c has to be among the most demanding in the country. i personally have probably only done one other hike that is close, which was the north ridge of mount tom in the eastern sierras. telescope peak from death valley i think is also comparable. i've also heard of people doing white mountain from the valley on the west side. all of these are cross country routes though. i know there is a trail leading from the valley up to whitney portal. if that is done in conjunction with the whitney portal trail then that would be a combined trail that my guess would slightly exceed c2c in gain. otherwise, you can always link multiple peaks together to achieve whatever difficulty you want. a good example of this in the san gabriels is doing the iron mountain ascent and then traversing up to baldy.