C2C/SKYLINE: CLOSED FOR THE SUMMER. COME BACK IN OCTOBER.

[bobodobo]

@Cynthia:

1. I was in the sun essentially all day on PCT / Little Round Valley route except where there were trees. The north facing slopes of the peak are too far away to provide any shade in early June when the sun is only 15 degrees from overhead at noon. Also from looking at Google Earth it seems like the tree line elevation is about the same on both routes, but someone can correct me if my interpretation of the satellite images is wrong. Anyway during summer I don't see how one can make the case that the shade is substantially different for the two routes.

2. There was very little wind on the day I did the hike (even on the summit it was almost dead calm), so the supposedly cooler airflow doesn't apply on the day I was there. I can't comment about a typical day since I've only been there once.

3. I'm 90% sure there at least as much elevation gain going the PCT route because even though one starts at about 1000' higher elevation, there is A LOT of downhill that one must regain, particularly due to all the criss-crossing on Fuller Ridge. I didn't measure the total downhill but I think it must be at least 1000', maybe as much as 2000'.

4. Neither route is a technical climb, and the elevations are nearly the same, so the comparison to K2 isn't valid. For a given elevation gain I can gain elevation faster on a steeper trail than one that covers 2 to 3 times the distance via switchbacks. (After all, why do people going uphill cut switchbacks if not to save time?) (And no I didn't cut any switchbacks, as much as I was tempted ... we all know that's no bueno.)

5. When one starts a blog in ALL CAPS saying that a trail is closed when in fact it isn't, yes some people would term that "alarmist." In hindsight of course I realize you were being facetious/sarcastic about the trail being closed, but I until I read the fine print a couple of times I did think it was true.

@Zé: That's not the way I hike. I don't hike at the same PACE regardless of how steep the trail is. I hike at a nearly constant EFFORT which I have gauged is one I can maintain for many hours. I speed up in flat sections and slow down in steep sections to maintain a constant effort. I have found through long experience that that's how I can most reliably attain my hiking goal for that day. And effort increases with both grade and distance - neither comes for free.

Good, safe hiking to everyone!

[cynthia23]

Also I haven't done Skyline yet, but my impression is

Bobo, don't you think it's a bit 'alarmist' for you to be opining in a public forum on the safety of a trail you've, ahem, never been on?

Since you've never done Skyline, you'll just have to trust us when we say it's harder and hotter than that section of the PCT. Further (lengthy and uninteresting) discussion of a topic (the PCT) which is totally unrelated to this thread, is beginning to edge you into troll territory, IMHO.

[bluerail]

I'll take him up....

Believe me, I've done them both plenty....theres a difference

[cynthia23]

[bobodobo]

bluerail, which is more difficult at this time of year in your opinion and why?

I did receive a message from one member of this board who had done both and said that they were similar in difficulty... but everyone who hikes has different capabilities and limitations, so I'm trying to decide which circumstances pertain to me.

I AM trolling... for answers to questions that would help me make an informed decision as to whether I should or should not attempt C2C during the summer and if so under what circumstances.

Thanks for your help!

Bobo

[wb]

I'm curious about some opinions of the quiz. Is it too hard to pass?

Hi Perry - Your quiz is really cool. When I first stumbled onto your site a few years back, I thought the quiz was quaint and amusing. Then I failed it - twice. Re-reading the information forced me to take note of the salient points made and in that regard the quiz served its purpose. I still think that it is a very clever educational device and hope that you keep it intact.

[Ed]

The quiz is a nice touch. Of course, I would think that, wouldn't I, as a retired professor? I would even be in favor of higher standards and more questions. For example, 6,000' of elevation gain for the calibration hike (e.g., the Bear Flats Trail on Baldy).

[bluerail]

dobo,
PCT is longer and much more of a slog, skyline is more to the point and i think if you look at the elevation/mileage ratio, skyline wins as being more of a workout...unless of course you are running the pct section, ( which is much easier than running skyline.)

best way to judge it though............just do it.


btw, ze is kinda freaky at determining alot of this stuff....he's usually always right on. It's what he does.

[HH8]

For example, 6,000' of elevation gain for the calibration hike (e.g., the Bear Flats Trail on Baldy).

Nice idea: can we compose a list of Skyline prep hikes?

[bobodobo]

Thanks bluerail, read and understood. "Slog" is a word I would definitely use to describe the PCT route and I was looking for a more direct route (weather and my capabilities permitting, of course.)

I do agree with Ze up to a point... a 1000' sheer vertical climb is much more difficult than a two mile hike on a trail with a 500'/mile grade. But on the other hand a 1000 mile hike on a trail with a 1'/mile grade would also be more difficult than the two mile hike. Obviously to gain 1000' there's some optimal grade between 90 degrees and 0.00001 degrees which minimizes the effort involved. The PCT was flatter than optimal in my opinion.

Finally, on a different subject that has been mentioned in this blog - while I totally understand and support the idea behind the C2C quiz, I know a little something about legal matters, and from a legal perspective it could be worse than no quiz... the law is VERY unkind to good Samaritans. By requiring one to pass a quiz before viewing the excellent C2C information, in the legal sense you may be implicitly stating that one is qualified to hike the C2C trail once they pass the quiz. Of course that's absolutely NOT the intent of the quiz but the law may view it otherwise. Legally a better approach might be a simple disclaimer like the one at the bottom of the C2C front page with a "I accept the terms and conditions blah blah blah" yes/no button. Anyway I'd suggest consulting legal advice on this issue if that hasn't been done already.