C2C in July

[cynthia23]

Zip: yeah, now that I know how much it costs to get bitten by a snake, I'm goin to be better about wearing my snake gaiters.

Bluerail: yes, 'impossibility" is a big word, but I think it's accurate. I don't know of anyone who has successfully (without death, illness or rescue) descended Skyline in summer during the daylight hours (i.e. from 10 to 5) during July. (of course, I'm not talking about just going up and down the first 1000 feet) I do recall someone here posting about a failed summer Skyline that forced descent during the day, and they did indeed make it down, but as I recall the poster presented it as a close call which made them quite sick. I'm wishing that OP (forgive my inability to recall your name ) would share his experiences again on this thread, it would add to the discussion.

Also, I think when people write in like this OP, we have no way of assessing their fitness level, and thousands of rescues (and many cognitive studies) show that most folks significantly overrate their own fitness levels. (not me though--I know just how wimpy I am But that's the benefit of living right next door to this butt-kickin' ego-bustin' mountain )

Ohiker: I don't think there would be snow year round, in fact I don't think there would be much snow at all. Maritime climates just don't get much snow. I think it would be more like Hawaii. But that's just my opinion. We need a meteorologist to weigh in on this important fantasy topic .

[Ed]

The vet bills for my dog were about $1700 after her rattlesnake bite on the nose. After three courses in rattlesnake aversion, she went after a baby rattler in a bush. Her sniffer is as good as ever, but I have heard about people with permanently withered legs.

It amuses me when I read about how the rattlesnake wants to avoid you. I've encountered many who have a 'stand your ground' philosophy. And I always seem about to step on one before I hear or see it.

The San Diego Union Tribune had an article today that reported that not only are rattlesnake bites in the county on an uptrend, but that the bites seem to be getting more venomous.

[slap67]

I’m glad I asked the question in the first place. This is a great way to get "local" info on a variety of issues dealing with this hike. I haven’t given the snake issue much thought. I can’t see a way to reduce the risk of a snake encounter at night, and I don’t think it’s sane to attempt this in July without starting before 1AM. Its also clear to me that this is a one-way trip this time of year, if anything happens on the trail once the suns up, you have to press on or call in a SAR team. Here's hoping for a cold front in July or it looks like Bady and San G again. (not bad for a plan B) thank you all for the input

[halhiker]

I wonder what the climate would be like on a Mount San Jacinto that was located in San Diego right on the coast, literally jutting out of the Pacific Ocean.

Would there be snow year round?

Maybe after the Big One we'll find out.

[bluerail]

cold fronts happen all summer long...theyre just pathetically and painfully relative.

[zippetydude]

It amuses me when I read about how the rattlesnake wants to avoid you. I've encountered many who have a 'stand your ground' philosophy. And I always seem about to step on one before I hear or see it.

That's my experience as well. I imagine this may ignite a whirlwind of politically correct responses, but if we actually reduced the number of rattlers (yep, i mean killin' 'em) and other snakes took their ecological place, why would that be so bad?

Before anyone responds, we're trying very enthusiastically to eradicate polio. That means we're killing each and every polio virus we encounter, with the hope of making them extinct during our lifetimes...how is that different? They don't know what they're doing, but they quite innocently kill us. So we kill them instead. Good choice. What makes rattlers so much more valuable than another living creature like a virus? Or your dog? Or you?

People hunted grizzlies until they were extinct in CA. So we can hike without the fatalities that they suffer in Alaska and Canada. True, there aren't many, but if that fatality were, say, your child, would you say it is just a sacrifice we have to make? That they were here first? Or that your child had no right to go into the wilderness, so it served them right for displaying such hubris?

I have yet to hear a clear, reasonable argument that we shouldn't do everything we can to eradicate rattlers and encourage other native species to replace them in their ecological role. They are aggressive, dangerous creatures that cause untold expense and suffering for about 8000 people each year in the US alone, with about 2400 of those victims suffering permanent damage to the tissue involved. That means you permanently lose function of that foot, or ankle, or hand...

Most of those people are avid outdoors people, like the people on this board. No, they're not all drunk hillbillies who have no better sense than to pick up an angry rattler.

So, what's wrong with those rattlesnake roundups? Personally, I'm not sure they're a bad idea. If there were a certain group of people that tried to kill 8000 people a year, wouldn't we want them removed? Just like a virus? What makes snakes so special? Even if most people live, ending up with a lame limb and $143,000 in debt are reason enough to me to remove the threat. How is that so wrong? Just a question.

z

[jfr]

Thank goodness there are no Grizzlies in California! And no bears at all south of I-10! My backpack is three pounds lighter when hiking in the San Jacinto Wilderness without that annoying plastic bear-proof can. And there is one thing I've noticed: Bears have no respect for private property. Or your life.

As for snakes, here's some snake humor from the movie "Ernest Saves Christmas":
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC9KRbdppzc

Is this thread about C2C suffering from "thread drift"? If so, I'm guilty, too.

[HH8]

Maybe after the Big One we'll find out.

Yeah, any day now everything EAST of the Rockies will dump into the Atlantic!

[Andy]

Zip,

I have to admit, your argument for the "eradication" of unfavorable species is original...and interesting to say the least. Your comparison to a virus is a good point in that a living organism is a living organism. Hey, where are all those PETA people on the AIDS epidemic?! Think of all those innocent baby e-coli and botulism bacteria I've ruthlessly slaughtered.

Seriously though, I know you have a penchant for all things that slither, though from your recent pictures you've come a long way. Me? I love almost all animals (mosquitoes, ear wigs and fire ants not included) and not in a crazy tree hugger sense, I just enjoy seeing and experiencing various life forms in nature. I cant imagine killing off all rattle snakes, grizzly bears, sharks and mt lions just because they add a very small level of danger to our lives.

For instance, I'm allergic to bees. Yes, the honey bee (a non-native, imported species by the way) could easily end my life, but watching one close up collecting pollen from a flower is fascinating and worth every bit of risk.

Beside, if we really want to avoid injury or fatalities in nature. We need to get that shade/breezeway, drinking fountains and guard rails installed on skyline as soon as possible.

[skunkboy]

halhiker wrote:

Maybe after the Big One we'll find out.

Cool! Maybe Desert Hot Springs could catch the south swells. Of course any earthquake that tore the Baja plate away from the North American plate, and made San Jac an island, would probably generate a half-mile high tsunami. If that happens, then running up the Skyline in the middle of summer might be a win-win situation. Better save those rattlesnakes for dinner... I heard they taste like chicken!