C2C/SKYLINE: CLOSED FOR THE SUMMER. COME BACK IN OCTOBER.

[Mountaingoat]

wow zip I totally agree with your previous post!!!

The "Goat" (Berne Mettenleiter)

[cynthia23]

I feel the last few posts have misrepresented what I said in my OP. I NEVER said "if you hike Skyline now you'll either be rescued or die." I said, if you hike Skyline now, AND IF ANYTHING GOES WRONG, you will either be rescued or die." "Anything" being something as trivial as food poisoning or unusual fatigue. The point which some people simply can't seem to get through their head is that you can't turn around in high-temp days. Most of the rescues don't involve broken legs (from which you can't self-rescue regardless of temps), they involve fatigue (from which you can self-rescue, by going down.) This is what differentiates a high-temp Skyline from Skyline on a mild day. I am NOT making the point that no one can do Skyline on a high-temp day; I've done it myself, several times, in June, July, and August. Yes, if you leave early enough and move quickly, you will experience no temps higher than eighty degrees, and the hike is unpleasant, but perfectly doable. THAT WASN"T my point. As I said in my previous post, which some seem not to have read, , I didn't fully understand the the hazard of a high=temp hike unti the day I got food poisoning halfway through Skyline, and it was, by then, too late to go down. I'm a slow plodder and that definitely puts me at higher risk; of course it's true that people who can do Skyline in four or five hours, such as Zip, aren't at great risk. But few people are at his superbly high level of conditioning, and many more simply overestimate their level of conditioning. These folks--and I think that's most of us--should never, ever attempt Skyline on a high temp day. I think at times there's a dangerously misleading quality to some of the TR's because casual readers of the board don't understand that the folks writing these TRs are former or current Ironmen, Ultramarathoners, and mountaineers with big peaks under their belts. As for those who think I'm being too much of a worrywart: sorry, but the high rate of rescue and death on Skyline makes it clear that I'm right and you're wrong. And the RMRU agrees with me. Tomorrow is going to be 99. I'll say it again: if you do Skyline on a day over 93, if anything at all goes wrong, you ARE going to be making the Cell Phone Call of Shame.

[HH8]

Risks

Dehydration
Getting lost
Exhaustion
Heat stroke
Rugged terrain
Cramping
Injuries
Rattlesnakes
No help

Preparation

Water
Cell phone
Extra socks & moleskin
Headlamp & batteries
Good snacks

Contingencies

Don't climb down DON'T DO IT!
Call for help ASAP
Seek shelter and wait for help to arrive

EXCELLENT recap.

[cynthia23]

It actually turned out to be 102 today.

[bluerail]

And extremely crowded on skyline today. We must have passed over twenty people, and ended up running into some at the peak.

This two day "cold front"made things nice enough, but there were some folks really struggling, and some really cramping up...

[Nick-SJM]

Lots of good and valuable replies. As stated by others above, my primarly concern is for the individuals who really don't know what they are getting into during the summer on Skyline. Those experienced with Skyline will probably make good decisions based on the factors they understand. To those who are first timers, I really suggest that you wait until October and find an experienced Skyliner to accompany.

[zippetydude]

Lots of good and valuable replies. As stated by others above, my primarly concern is for the individuals who really don't know what they are getting into during the summer on Skyline. Those experienced with Skyline will probably make good decisions based on the factors they understand. To those who are first timers, I really suggest that you wait until October and find an experienced Skyliner to accompany.

That's what I did my first time. And I'm glad I did. It was a wonderful first experience.

z

[bcrowell]

To those who are first timers, I really suggest that you wait until October and find an experienced Skyliner to accompany.

The Mt. San Jacinto Hiking Club http://www.meetup.com/Hiking-Coachella-Valley has a Skyline hike most Saturdays in the spring and fall.

[Nick-SJM]

bcrowell-
I think it would be great if a posting were made once a month in the spring and fall about this option for first-timers. Also, maybe during the summer and winter to encourage first-timers to wait for an opportunity to join a group that could share their knowledge.

[soulcamp]

Yesterday on Skyline, I encountered a group at the picnic tables who had hiked Devil's Slide last weekend and were doing their first C2C. I asked how much water they were carrying. They told me 3L, which I promptly told them probably too little for even just Skyline with the current temps, let alone a full C2C. I also told them that if anything happened, don't try to head back down - the rise in temps would get them in far more trouble. We passed them around 6500' - they looked like they were struggling, but they weren't in trouble. We also passed a guy who's leg was cramping up and his GF was massaging it and a couple of other guys who had left at 2:30am and admitted the hike was *much* harder then they had expected. We wound up sharing a cab with them back to the museum. As far as I know, none of these people died or had to be rescued.

My point is, that while Skyline is dangerous, the number of people who die or need to be rescued is a very small percentage of those who attempt it. The tone of this thread (at least initially) was contrary to this fact. And I feel that makes it misleading.

I am NOT making the point that no one can do Skyline on a high-temp day; I've done it myself, several times, in June, July, and August. Yes, if you leave early enough and move quickly, you will experience no temps higher than eighty degrees, and the hike is unpleasant, but perfectly doable. THAT WASN"T my point.

I know that wasn't your point, but until this reply, you NEVER said that. In fact, you implied exactly the opposite. And that's my point. If you mislead people, they are less likely to pay attention to what you have to say, even when what you have to say could *really* help them. And to zip's point, going beyond just informing people and to the extreme of TELLING them what they can and can't do (take this thread's title as an example), you further risk alienating people. People who would otherwise really benefit from the valuable information that you and others could provide.

I think your story about getting food poisoning and making the decision to try to hike back down is far better served as an example of how even experienced people can get in trouble and make mistakes. You don't have to take it any further than that. Smart people are going to learn from your experience and be better prepared. Others aren't going to listen to you anyway, no matter what you have to say.

IMO, the best approach here is to give people as much information as possible - the more, the better - and let them utilize that info to make their decision. Emphasize the additional risks involved with high temperatures. But also emphasize the dozens of OTHER risks that exist, no matter what the temperature is like. Skyline is a difficult hike, and the more people know about what they are getting into, the better off they are going to be, even if they don't need to be rescued.