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[Vnthali]

Alan my access to the I-10 fast lane is not being unreasonablly restricted. I'm allowed to drive there whenever I want, and so are the folks who don't pay taxes too. Access to the mountain is not a privilage the state or the DWP should be able to unreasonably restrict - period.

[AlanK]

Alan my access to the I-10 fast lane is not being unreasonablly restricted. I'm allowed to drive there whenever I want, and so are the folks who don't pay taxes too. Access to the mountain is not a privilage the state or the DWP should be able to unreasonably restrict - period.

Actually, I agree with that last sentence. However, I would not be surprised if the courts upheld the right of the agencies in question to restrict access, but I sure don't think they should have that right in this case. What I think will not get anyone out of whatever fines they have to pay, etc., though. But when they put me in charge, folks will be able to climb!

[Zé]

For example, the fast lane of the westbound I-10 in Banning is public land..

See I tried to convince FO that he was legally allowed and should try this, but he didn't bite

[backpack7]

I just wonder what the invitation looked like that made people volunteer for the DWA sting operation:

COME ONE, COME ALL: Let's catch these hippie bastards!
Where?: Snow Creek
What to Bring: Camo gear (preferrably something resembling the local flora, or bighorn sheep antlers, since I know you all got some), climbing gear (let's blend in with those hippie bastards, and then we will take them from behind, they won't know what took 'em).
Law Enforcement Experience: None is encouraged, but if you have some, we won't look down on you. Oh, and border patrol experience is a plus.

Down with that climbing swine! They have pooped in our precious Palm Springs Golf Course Lawn water for the last time!!![/u]

[zippetydude]

Whoa! Hold on just a little bit...Resolutions are found when cooler heads prevail. Has anyone actually spoken to anyone on the Ranger staff recently? Maybe they were buttheads 20 years ago (though I'm skeptical on that), but it seems fair to at least talk to the current staff, doesn't it?

I've also "heard" that they hate anyone doing Skyline, but I've never heard it directly from them. I'm hoping someone with a calm disposition will have a chance to look into this dispassionately and get some information. If it's as bad as it sounds, then we'll have a reason to get all fiery, but for now, we don't actually have much first hand information about anything happening.

z

[zippetydude]

Whoa! Hold on just a little bit...Resolutions are found when cooler heads prevail. Has anyone actually spoken to anyone on the Ranger staff recently? Maybe they were buttheads 20 years ago (whough I'm skeptical on that), but it seems fair to at least talk to the current staff, doesn't it?

I've also "heard" that they hate anyone doing Skyline, but I've never heard it directly from them. I'm hoping someone with a calm disposition will have a chance to look into this dispassionately and get some information. If it's as bad as it sounds, then we'll have a reason to get all fiery, but for now, we don't actually have much first hand information about anything happening.

z

Unfortunately, I've spoken to people who experienced this Gestapo raid, and it seems everything I said above is irrelevant. Hmmm. Shall we speak in private and discuss all future plans where they can't stick their unwanted noses in? I'm disappointed and disgusted. This is not Nazi Germany.

z

[AlanK]

Whoa! Hold on just a little bit...Resolutions are found when cooler heads prevail. Has anyone actually spoken to anyone on the Ranger staff recently? Maybe they were buttheads 20 years ago (whough I'm skeptical on that), but it seems fair to at least talk to the current staff, doesn't it?

I've also "heard" that they hate anyone doing Skyline, but I've never heard it directly from them. I'm hoping someone with a calm disposition will have a chance to look into this dispassionately and get some information. If it's as bad as it sounds, then we'll have a reason to get all fiery, but for now, we don't actually have much first hand information about anything happening.

z

Unfortunately, I've spoken to people who experienced this Gestapo raid, and it seems everything I said above is irrelevant. Hmmm. Shall we speak in private and discuss all future plans where they can't stick their unwanted noses in? I'm disappointed and disgusted. This is not Nazi Germany.

For starters, why doesn't someone who experienced the Gestapo tactics make a complaint? I would think that everyone affected would lodge protests with the DWA and send letters to the local papers. if the descriptions were anywhere near accurate, the goons were way out of line and should be in fear of legal action.

[sdtrackrunner]

I spoke with a ranger on duty at the long valley station today and got very reasonable responses to questions about snow creek and had a nice conversation. Give the rangers a call and ask your questions. I'd rather not speak for them here, especially with all the recent drama.

[halhiker]

So, at any time during your "nice conversation" did the SS, I mean rangers, offer to give you a permit for this weekend's attempt of Snow Creek?

[zippetydude]

It might be a good idea to consider the rangers and water people separately. All allegations I've heard have been against the water service - the rangers waiting at the peak apparently had no chance to actually interact with anyone, since the water service ruined the outing for all concerned.

However, if the rangers are concerned, and if it is genuinely about people's safety, then they might be better served to actually join the board here and voice conscientious objections. This would be well received, if not universally heeded. Case in point: Snow Creek. That route scares me, and I'm afraid it could lead to someone getting hurt. However, I voice this to people in person who are planning on doing it - you won't see me prowling around with my camera so I can take pictures and rat them out. Rangers sitting at the peak waiting to "sting" someone who didn't get a permit (there are no permits available for many miles from snow creek, so it's more a matter of logistics than of deliberately flaunting the law) takes away from their credibility to me.

z