Snow on Mt, Sn Jacinto

[Nate]

I called the San Jacinto SP ramger's office in Idyllwild a few days ago about climbibg San Jacinto, and the guy who answered the phone said that there is snow above 9100 feet, and that they strongly recommend crampons -- for those with enough experience to attempt such dangerous feat. I am skeptical. Has any one of you been up there recently? The man on the phone said that it's easy to get lost when there's snow on the ground. I won't argue with that, but I did ask him: why don't they blase the trails, or at least put ribbons on trees so that hikers don't get lost when there's snow on the ground? He said he had no idea -- that he's never neen up there, works only out of the station in Idyllwild. This brings to mind June, 2005. The folks at the rangers' office said one would need crampons and an ice axe to get up San Jacinto via Little Round Lake. Indeed, LRL was still snowed in, but the trail was clear just above it. The problem for hikers was that there are no blaze marks, nor even ribbons, to indicate where the trail lies. I met many people who wnt to a great deal of trouble to climb San J, only to get lost in Little Round Valley. I reported at the Ranger's station what I had witnessed, and all they could say is that blaze marks and ribbons are unsightly -- nothing about the misinformation they were giving out to anyone who made inquiries.about the hike.

So, how is it now, from Humber Park to the summit, via Wel, Divide?

[calicokat]

Just hiked to the summit via Humber Park on Thursday. No need for crampons, there is maybe four small patches of snow that are not even on the trail. Its all gone.

[hikehigh]

The rangers always over exaggerate conditions. I think they give advise as if everyone was a novice. I don't blame them. If they told you the trail is free of snow, then you slip on the 1 patch of snow that is left and you crack your head open on a rock......

I find its better to check this board and others for conditions. You can get info and often times pictures from recent trips.

Just remember the person giving you the information maybe a seasoned mountaineer, or a rookie.

[Nick-SJM]

Some of the information you might receive over the telephone from both the Forest Service and State Park may not be as good as it should at times. Often the person providing information feels that they need to provide information when they really don't have good up to date information. If you get bad information, call back later and ask for a supervisor. Let them know that misleading information is being released. They need to know. Most of the people that I have known in both the Forest Service and State Park want to do a good job and be helpful. Let them know when they fall short. The above suggestion to try to get information from this board is a good idea.

Regarding the marking of trails (as many of you probably know) most of the high country in the San Jacinto District of the National Forest and Mount San Jacinto State Park is in designated Wilderness. Thus the need for a Wilderness permit. One of the goals for a Wilderness is to minimize any sign of man's imprint on the area. Therefore, there are not suppose to be flagging (ribbons), tree blazes, or cairns. Even signs require high level administrative approval. Yes, it may make trail identification harder. However, a wilderness is not suppose to be easy. It is suppose to be natural. An argument can be made that safety should have a high level of priority. However, that can be a slippery slope of government taking care of us. No thanks.

[asabat]

Regarding the marking of trails (as many of you probably know) most of the high country in the San Jacinto District of the National Forest and Mount San Jacinto State Park is in designated Wilderness. ...Therefore, there are not suppose to be flagging (ribbons), tree blazes, or cairns. ...However, a wilderness is not suppose to be easy. It is suppose to be natural. An argument can be made that safety should have a high level of priority. However, that can be a slippery slope of government taking care of us. No thanks.

Thank you! Blazes and flagging are not necessary if one has a map and compass and knows how to use it. Now GPS receivers with maps make it even easier, at least until the batteries go dead.

[Norris]

This past winter on snow-shoeing trips, I noted occasional tiny pieces of orange day-glo tied to the tips of pine tree branches to mark the route through forested / deep snow areas on both the Devils's Slide trail and the Vivian Creek trail. So someone is putting them up. Personally, if kept to a minimum and only used in forested areas that tend to create route-finding problems in the winter, I don't have a problem with them.

[loriwilliams]

Hiked from Humber Park to Peak via Wellman's Divide this weekend. Faint traces of snow--no need for ice ax or crampons.