San G. with young children, how to shorten summit day?

[phydeux]

High Creek is only 3.5 - 4.0 miles to the summit, anyone in reasonable shape should be able to get from there to the summit and back in one day. Simply start early in the AM, take your time, and you should be able to make it. Should be plenty of water at High Creek. If you have time, have everyone get on a workout program (even walking around the block on a regular basis) to make it easier.

Hi phydeux, One of the boys is only 7, and I'm just trying to make sure he has a good time instead of whining and wanting to turn the group around. 8 miles seemed a bit much for a 7 year-old to me.Unfortunately, even with Hikin Jim's shortcut, its just about as far from Fish Creek Saddle to the summit as from High Creek Camp! But significantly, there is less elevation gain on summit day, about 600 ft or so. The total elevation gain on Fish Creek is quite a bit less due to the higher elevation of the trailhead. Assuming 2 camps on the way up, with the Fish Creek approach we would have only about 400 ft of elevation gain the first afternoon over 2.2 miles to Fish Creek trail camp, versus 1,000 ft of elevation gain from Vivian Creek trailhead to Vivian Creek camp over 1.2 miles. The second day would be easier too. On Vivian creek, they would have to climb 2,000 ft from Vivian Creek camp to High Creek camp over 4 miles. On Fish Creek, its only 2.2 more miles from Fish Creek Trail camp to Fish Creek Saddle.

You DO realize that High Creek to the summit is 4 miles UP, then 4 miles DOWN, don't you? and not 8 miles of continuous uphill? The 4 miles up will be the hard part, I'd expect the 4 miles back down would be a breeze for pre-teen kids unless they're devoted couch potatoes and/or Nintendo addicts. I'd expect the adults to have more problems; they're usually more out of shape than their kids. As long as the weather forecast looks sunny and clear, carry only what's needed to stay warm at +40F night temps, not -40F arctic winter temps. It was about that temp at the summit this weekend (the snow patches on the summit didn't freeze overnight), so it should be a few degrees warmer at High Creek, Dry Lake, or Fish Creek. And don't forget the mosquito repellant - they can be nasty at any of the lower camps (none at the summit ).

[AlanK]

Alan, did you use the South Fork trailhead to access Dollar Saddle?

We used the South Fork Trailhead. We stopped at Dollar LAke for a nice break and then headed up to Dollar Lake Saddle. We camped at Red Rock Flat (a legal campground), which is about a quarter mile to the west. High Meadow Springs is a bit further but is a great source of water. It's about four miles to the summit from the camp.

[KathyW]

[quote="AlanK"][quote="Norris"]Alan, did you use the South Fork trailhead to access Dollar Saddle?[/quote]
We used the South Fork Trailhead. We stopped at Dollar LAke for a nice break and then headed up to Dollar Lake Saddle. We camped at Red Rock Flat (a legal campground), which is about a quarter mile to the west. High Meadow Springs is a bit further but is a great source of water. It's about four miles to the summit from the camp.[/quote]

Is Dry Lake view not a designated campsite anymore? It was when we camped there a few years back. You'll want to make sure you camp in a designated campsite - they're pretty strict about that in the summer.

[AlanK]

Is Dry Lake view not a designated campsite anymore? It was when we camped there a few years back. You'll want to make sure you camp in a designated campsite - they're pretty strict about that in the summer.

I didn't mean to imply that Dry Lake View is not a legal camping area. I don't know its status, but I have certainly seen tents there on several occasions.

[KathyW]

[quote="AlanK"][quote="KathyW"]Is Dry Lake view not a designated campsite anymore? It was when we camped there a few years back. You'll want to make sure you camp in a designated campsite - they're pretty strict about that in the summer.[/quote]
I didn't mean to imply that Dry Lake View is not a legal camping area. I don't know its status, but I have certainly seen tents there on several occasions.[/quote]

I think it is still a designated trail camp, but I notice that they don't list it on the website under the description for the South Fork Trail. That made me wonder if they had removed it as a campsite. I guess the best way to find out is contacting the Ranger Station - you have to list your campsite when you get a permit.

[Hikin_Jim]

The overnight wilderness permit application for the SGW does list Dry Lake View as a camp site option. There shouldn't be any problem (other than the possibility of all the permits being already booked for the date you want) if one were to want to camp there.

I don't recall any camping locations being taken "out of service" in the SGW in the last dozen or so years. I think the designated sites as they now exist are pretty stable.

[halhiker]

This may not be of interest but what about a day hike via Fish Creek? My 10 year old made San Jacinto with no difficulty from the Tram when he was 9 and San G from Fish Creek is even more gentle, albeit longer than that trail.

You could do a trial ahead of time on San J and see how the dads hold up (I have no doubt the kids will be OK).

The advantages of it are:
No carrying heavy packs.
No overnight backcountry camping for novices.
No altitude sickness from sleeping at high elevation.

I've done Fish Creek a number of times and the last time made it to the summit in less than three hours--we were doing Fish Creek to Angeles Oaks in one day.

I do concur that Jim's shortcut is the best way to go and cuts of LOTS of unnecessary mileage. It is class one. There is no need to use hands and feet to climb.

Just a thought.

[hvydrt]

I second the Dry lake View or Dollar Saddle. I believe there is a small shelter built at dry lake view????

[KathyW]

I don't think you can camp at Dollar Lake Saddle, but Dry Lake View is a wonderful campsite except for the lack of water.

[Norris]

Thanks everyone for your suggestions! I appreciate the input.