Hiker Lost Near The Tram

[lightgy]

As for some agency closing the trail what will that do? The north face is "closed" but that doesn't stop people from going. Drive out to I-10 and Gene Autry Trail. Look at Mt. San Jacinto and tell me that C2C is the only route up to the tram station. C2C is just easier for the sheep to follow

As one of the herd ---this "hiking sheep" , would gladly contribute to a sign to help keep the trail open.

[hikehigh]

....mixed feeling re. message-boards & the popularity of Skyline....... I also picked the location so as not to be seen from below, to keep others from getting dumb ideas who may not know of the trail......I still feel that those that insist on publishing every last gps coordinate, photo, map, etc. are opening it up for more ill-fated attempts..........C2C is just easier for the sheep to follow

I don't understand this mentality. Why should the trail be kept a secret? Who are you or anyone else to decide who gets to know about a trail? There is always going to be people getting in over their heads, no matter if there is a sign, or if people like you don't share info with others who enjoy the outdoors.

Why is it so bad that a certain trail is popular? There are places that you can go to be alone and there are those that you expect to see others. Get over it.

[guest]

post edited

[hikehigh]

I understand this thread is about minimizing injury and rescues onC2C. I think it is an important issue and I am glad you put the first sign there.

What I don't understand is why you felt the need to put the sign out of sight so "dumb people" wont know about the trail.

[FIGHT ON]

I agree with many here, signs can help, but also tempt ego-mongers.

I AGREE!
I don't need a sign not to smoke. Smoking is a stupidest thing in the world to do but people still do it KNOWING it can kill them.
No matter what you put on a hike warning sign there will always be "SOMEBODY" that will either ignore it, take it as a challenge, (I don't need to carry that stuff because I'm me.) be offended, (nobody's gonna tell me how to hike! who do they think they are trying to tell me to be careful, I'll show them!) you can't stop crazy people.
I still think it's better to have signs though.

[Dave G]

Every time some fool gets in trouble on this route, (& yes, even prepared hikers can get in over their heads) almost all the local resources are taken away from their other duties, or other emergencies that may be happening simultaneously, (i.e. as when a regular contributor on this board became stranded at the peak).

Hmm, does that mean that the "prepared hikers" are fools when they require assistance?

I attended a banquet not long ago with some SAR friends and the mc asked for a show of hands as to how many rescuers had at some point become rescuees. You might be surprised at the number! No matter how well you manage the risks of hiking and mountaineering, things can just sometimes go very wrong.

BTW, I agree that another sign might be useful. It could even have photos of casualties (nothing too graphic). I recall seeing a sign like that up at Whitney one winter and it seemed to be very effective. The very best thing though, IMHO, is to continue to do what most people on this board are already doing and that is to engage, and sometimes educate, other hikers that you encounter along the trail.

Dave

[magikwalt]

I like Dave G's comment above. I believe I have better impact on fellow hikers not doing the hike during bad conditions by communicating my refusal to do it in bad conditions. I know there are many of us that can do the hike during winter conditions but choose not to on a personal level. I am not against another sign I just don't think it is going to change anyone's mind once they are on the trail. If it did then the sign about the sheep should close the trail for half the year.

[halhiker]

I like Dave G's comment above. I believe I have better impact on fellow hikers not doing the hike during bad conditions by communicating my refusal to do it in bad conditions. I know there are many of us that can do the hike during winter conditions but choose not to on a personal level. I am not against another sign I just don't think it is going to change anyone's mind once they are on the trail. If it did then the sign about the sheep should close the trail for half the year.

My thought on the winter sign is to warn the potentially ignorant. There are some people who may have no idea that the top is covered in snow because it's so nice down in the desert. Those are the people a sign might help. Those choosing with full knowledge of conditions are a different matter.

The sheep issue is something altogether different. I am fully aware of the sheep issue and CHOOSE to ignore that sign. Personally, I feel my hiking in an area has little or no adverse effect on the sheep.

[FIGHT ON]

I like Dave G's comment above. I believe I have better impact on fellow hikers not doing the hike during bad conditions by communicating my refusal to do it in bad conditions. I know there are many of us that can do the hike during winter conditions but choose not to on a personal level. I am not against another sign I just don't think it is going to change anyone's mind once they are on the trail. If it did then the sign about the sheep should close the trail for half the year.

My thought on the winter sign is to warn the potentially ignorant. There are some people who may have no idea that the top is covered in snow because it's so nice down in the desert. Those are the people a sign might help. Those choosing with full knowledge of conditions are a different matter.

I agree and think this sign should be placed at the trail heads, not up the trail out of sight where people can't see it before they start hiking. An additional sign up a ways would be good but if that's the only one I think it would piss some people off. (why didn't they tell me before I started! I'm gonna smash this sign down!) And make it harder to turn around because they already started hiking. Better to read it before they put on their packs and before they start hiking.

The sheep issue is something altogether different. I am fully aware of the sheep issue and CHOOSE to ignore that sign. Personally, I feel my hiking in an area has little or no adverse effect on the sheep.

Where is this sign at? Does anyone have a picture of it?

[bluerail]

I think Fight Ons picture of Jack Nicholson would be good on a winter warning sign. Maybe perfect.