East Fork to Allison Gulch, Allison Mine Loop

[Zé]

TR here

[Dave G]

Very cool TR! Now I know where the footprints came from that I saw on the way back down from Iron. I've wanted to check out that mine--just never taken the time to do it. Looks like fun!

Dave

[Rick M]

As a geologist, I worked for a Swiss mining company in Southern California, a Ranger in Death Valley and was on a Mine Rescue team for 8 years. All I can advise is don't go in any abandoned mines. I've been in hundreds, sometimes volunteering to recover bodies, and can say if there was anything of value in the mines the miners already took it. Because timbers (trees) were scarce and hard to come by especially in the desert, many times the miners took them on their way out of played out mines to use/sell elsewhere and modern explorers think the mine must be safe cause the miners didn't have to shore up the mine. Gases can also be a problem (we carried gas detectors) and unfortunately, abandoned mines are being used today as drug labs with lots of nasty stuff sometimes dumped in them (though probably not the Allison). Many times the openings of vertical shafts are undermined from years of weathering and neglect waiting for someone to step near (I was lowered 127' down such a vertical 3'x3' sh!aft to retrieve a body). We also had to "abandon" one of our abandoned mines we often used for rescue training that we thought was reasonably safe when it collapsed. I've been in many working mines that are inspected daily and still could be considered "dangerous places to work" if you don't know what you're doing. Looking for rocks and minerals on the dump piles can be interesting but in abandoned mines, all bets are off. I've been to the Allison a few times on the way up Iron and Baldy and it is not on any list of "safe" mines of mine...just think of the quality of our rock for rock climbing. Help volunteer rescue people by staying out of abandoned mines. Just my thoughts.

[Zé]

I understand where you are coming from, but how can you expect people to stay out of an abandoned mine that is written up in Trails of the Angeles?

[Rick M]

...how can you expect people to stay out of an abandoned mine that is written up in Trails of the Angeles?

I can't. And as I mentioned, just my thoughts. Telling the history is great but I think if people chose to write about these places they should also mention the dangers associated with going into such places. Since I can't put this warning in those already published books I hope mentioning it here might perhaps cause anyone reading this thread to think twice about going into abandoned mines and maybe even prevent someone from being injured or killed. Part of SAR is something called PSAR, Preventative Search and Rescue that includes educating people about dangerous things. One of the scariest things I ever did was to go crawling underground in search of someone that got separated from their friend. The fire department was called but declined to go in for the search and we were called. And this was the day after a 5-magnitude quake hit less than 10 miles away..

...I've wanted to check out that mine--just never taken the time to do it. Looks like fun!

In the final analysis, people make the final decision but hopefully this might make them stop and think about that choice.

[Dave G]

Jim, I appreciate where you are coming from; many of my best climbing and hiking friends are SAR personnel and I'm familiar with the mentality.

However, it would be a mistake for you to assume that I am any less qualified, or would be any less cautious than yourself while visiting a mine. And I'm certainly not suggesting that others do so either, even though as Ze pointed out, numerous abandoned mines in the San Gabriels and elsewhere are well publicized and might even be considered "attractive nuisances".

Dave