Hydration

[drndr]

Any opinion on specific brand "Amino Vital". in 8 oz serving you get 30 calories, 8 carbs, 10mg sodium, 50mg potassium, then 960mg amino acids. I have always used Gatorade, slightly weakened, and have been fine. Doing Grand Canyon, rim to River and back in a day and thought I would try this. Love to get opinions on these Amino Acid laced drinks.

[phydeux]

I just drink water, about 5-6 qts per day. If, by some strange twist of fate, I become a professional "endurance athlete" whose income relies on beating someone by milliseconds (as opposed to a 'cubicle slave' who hikes on the weekends for fun), then I'll worry about the minutia of minerals, vitamins, and how to cheat the lab rats testing my "precious bodily fluids" for steriods, EPO, etc.

For calories, I just consume what I like (and can stomach) on the trail. Most prepared and pre-packed foods are fairly well loaded down with minerals and other nutrients (especially salt/sodium).

If you're partial to those convienient freeze dried meals (Mountain House, Backpackers Pantry, etc), most of those contain about a month's worth of sodium in one package.

And don't forget to get yourself into shape with some regular aerobic activity. The better you condition yourself for an endurance activity like hiking, the farther you'll be able to go, and it'll be more enjoyable, too.

[magikwalt]

Hi drndr,

I don't have any input on your specific product but would like to caution against making a change to "whats working" without some real world testing on yourself.

Last year I made a move to a commerical product and used their product during some of my shorter hikes. I was looking for something to carry me for 13-14 hours worth of hard hiking. I used a hike to the tram as my real world test. Three hours in at 5,000ft and I was sick to my stomach. ZippetyDude found me on the traverse laid out on a rock with muscle cramps causing me to yelp with pain.

Back to what works for me.

[Perry]

If, by some strange twist of fate, I become a professional "endurance athlete" whose income relies on beating someone by milliseconds...

Sometimes this kind of stuff can make a huge difference, even for a recreational hiker trying to do something aerobically just for the endorphin rush. The maltodextrin-fructose drinks really make a big difference in absorption rate compared to the cheaper glucose-sucrose drinks. If you don't like ordering the ingredients and mixing them as I do, GU2O is a nice drink with plenty of sodium (which also makes a big difference in reducing muscle cramps). Running Wild in Palm Springs has it. Cytomax is similar, but has a bunch of other ingredients that are hard to pronounce. I don't know what the effects of those additional substances are, besides the obvious placebo/marketing aspect. It is also more expensive.

[drndr]

magicwalt,

thanks for the input. You mean waiting til climbing out of the grand canyon after already doing 11 miles might not be the best idea, lol!

Maybe i'll bring a little and let everyone try a bit for fun.

Thanks again

[Ellen]

Howdy HikeUp

You asked:

"Is hyponatremia a more serious condition that dehydration? I'm sure it's not a clear cut answer, but if you had a choice of drinking too much (leading to hyponatremia) vs. not drinking enough (leading to dehydration) which is the least risky choice on a strenuous hike?"

Yes -- hyponatremia is more serious than dehydration. As a sports med MD friend of mine Randy Eichner said, "Dehydration kills performance, hyponatremia kills." Bottom line, I would err on the side of not drinking enough and being slightly dehydrated.

The idea is to closely match your sweat rate to prevent losing more than 2% of your weight. Losing 1 to 2 lb is fine, as this represents less than 2% of your body weight. It sounds to me like you're matching your sweat losses pretty well and doing a good job "listening" to your body.

Hyponatremia is scary because the early symptoms can resemble those of dehydration. Early signs and symptoms of hyponatremia tend to develop when the plasma sodium concentration falls below 130 mmol/L and include bloating, “puffiness,” nausea, vomiting, and headache.

Symptoms of impending heat illness due to dehydration include weakness, chills, goose bumps on the chest and upper arms, nausea, headache, faintness, disorientation, muscle cramping, and cessation of sweating.

As the severity of hyponatremia increases — with serum sodium concentration below 125 mmol/L — more serious signs and symptoms occur due to increased cerebral edema (brain swelling). These include altered mental status (confusion, disorientation, and agitation), seizures, respiratory distress (due to pulmonary edema), unresponsiveness, coma and death.

Treatment in the hospital ER may include hypertonic solutions of sodium chloride or hypertonic mannitol to immediately decrease brain edema. Time is of the essence in treatment.

This is why dehydration is preferable to hypnonatremia in the wilderness.

Miles of smiles,
Ellen

[Ellen]

Howdy Rick and any other SAR members

I am happy to provide sports nutrition advice for you and any other SAR members. I've already told Jim Bakos that I'll happily consult with RMRU as a sports dietitian for life The same offer goes to members of this board -- so many of you were there for me mentally and physically.

I'm honored that you quoted from my book

I think it's awesome that you always try to have an extra liter of water for a hiker in need.

I recommend that SAR members try to optimize recovery by taking in both adequate carbohydrate and fluid ASAP. The carbohydrate promotes restoration of muscle glycogen (your limited hiking fuel) and fluid replaces sweat losses.

For athletes, I recommend 1 g of carbohydrate per kg within 30 minutes after exercise. If that sounds like too much, shoot for 50 gams of carbohydrate. Research shows the muscles store more glycogen right after exercise compared to hanging around for a few hours and then eating/drinking.

To replace fluid losses, I recommend drinking 150% of your fluid losses or 24 ounces of fluid for every lb lost. This is to offset the obligatory urine losses. Consuming a sports drink with sodium (or foods with sodium) helps the body retain the fluid.

You made the excellent point earlier that you can't predict when you'll be called out on a rescue. As a result, you can't "plan" a pre-rescue meal. If possible, I recommend keeping a cooler in your car regularly stocked with high carbohydrate snacks and fluids.

I have a handout called "Survival guide for eating out." If you e-mail me, I can send to you.

Miles of smiles,
Ellen

[Ellen]

Howdy All

Phydeux raised an interesting point -- why care about using nutritional strategies to hike faster or further?

Some hikers (I'm one) like to keep track of the time it takes to peak out or reach the tram via Skyline. I keep track to compare my pace from year to year and more importantly, to gauge my fitness for other hikes I want to do. I can't compete in endurance events anymore, but I guess I still "think" like an athlete.

I've helped endurance athletes with specific nutrition strategies because they want to set a personal record in their event. I've also worked with endurance athletes who aren't concerned with time so much as wanting to feel good as long as possible. Utlimately, food is fuel. It won't make up for inadequate training.

I think most hikers want to feel as good as long as possible, regardless of pace. Perry said it quite well:
"Sometimes this kind of stuff can make a huge difference, even for a recreational hiker trying to do something aerobically just for the endorphin rush."

Miles of smiles,
Ellen

[HikeUp]

Ellen, thanks for taking the time to answer my question. The information is very informative and will hopefully make hiking an even more enjoyable experience than it already is (or at least reduce the suffering that follows a day long death march!).

[AlanK]

I just drink water, about 5-6 qts per day. If, by some strange twist of fate, I become a professional "endurance athlete" whose income relies on beating someone by milliseconds (as opposed to a 'cubicle slave' who hikes on the weekends for fun), then I'll worry about the minutia of minerals, vitamins, and how to cheat the lab rats testing my "precious bodily fluids" for steriods, EPO, etc.

I think that this is an oversimplification. I hike on weekends for fun. (OK, I do get out during the week on occasion.) I am not racing anyone. But, let's say that I decide to hike up Iron Mountain on some weekend in June. It gets hot. I get thirsty. If I drink only water, I have problems. If I simply replace some of that water with any of the available electrolyte replacement drinks, I have no problems.

Listening to advice from people like Ellen is just common sense.