Ellen's caffeine article

[FIGHT ON]

Thanks for the good article Ellen.

Fighton: You have already expressed your opinion that you do not think it is good to ingest caffeine when hiking; so now it's time to move on to another subject. We don't need to have you continue to reinforce how "good and perfect" you are because you don't ingest caffeine. Maybe you need this type of reinforcement, but I don't think other people that frequent this message board do.

GU is a brand name - some varieties have caffeine and others do not.

KathyW: Maybe you overlooked some of the content of Z's post or for that matter all together.
I'm sure some of his comments were directed toward mine and invited a response.

Because you don't like or disagree with someones views on administrating stimulants/drugs should not be used as tool to limit responses.

That would be unfair.

And if you feel less than "good and perfect" because you take stimulants or of my views, I feel sorry for you.

[FIGHT ON]

Pretty sure GU contains caffeine too.

Of course you've expressed your opinion on that subject many times, in several places, even though you admit it is not based on actual knowledge.

Kathy is right. Give it a rest, man!

Hey AlanK.
I didn't bring up the subject of GU here.
Did you miss Z's post too?
Maybe you should "Give it a rest, man!"

[FIGHT ON]

....nothing I like more than getting jacked up on caffiene and sugar, going out in the desert and kicking over cairns and stampin my name on stuff.

I don't kick over cairns blue! That's Hal! (but I do save time signing my name on registers by using my famous stamp!) But that's off topic btw.
Let's all stay on topic here. Caffeine!

[Ellen]

Howdy All

I posted the article purely for educational value. As with previous discussions on hiking foods/fluids, the hiker/runner/cyclist/triathlete's choice is highly individual. My goal as a sports dietitian is to help each person find the fueling plan (food and fluid) that works the best for them.

I like coffee. I drink a large mug of Peets Major Dickenson blend in the morning. As noted in the article, coffee is not necessarily the best source of caffeine due to other compounds.

While hiking, I alternate between vanilla Gu (no caffeine) and PowerGel
Double Latte (50 mg caffeine).

Howdy Z-dude

I'm not an early morning person either

There have been research studies addressing the time of day (morning versus afternoon) and performance in elite athletes. If I recall correctly, performance is better in the afternoon. It has to do with Circadian rhythms and hormone levels.

To improve morning performance, you could fly east and adjust to the Eastern time zone, then come home and race. You'd be fighting the body's Circadian rhythm to try to live by Eastern time at Pacific time.

Waving a red flag here -- Caffeine is well-known to help people adjust to jet lag.

Miles of smiles,
Ellen

[FIGHT ON]

My goal as a sports dietitian is to help each person find the fueling plan (food and fluid) that works the best for them.

Caffeine isn't a food or fluid. or fuel!
It's a stimulant with zero nutritional value!

[Zé]

Oh no! Not you too?
If caffeine is the same as all this other stuff then why not make a cup of them in the mornin to wake up instead?
Don't see em on a Starbucks menu, do you?

What happens to the heart rate when caffeine is consumed? (does it get slower?:lol:)
Any nutritional value?
It's not food!
It's a stimulant taken to target the heart, to increase its rate and strengthen each beat.
You can claim that you are taking it for other reasons all day long but this is the real reason it is taken.
I mean you can say you take it to wake up and not for the purpose to hike faster or further but that doesn't change that it does. (peek a boo, I see you!:lol:)

so you've been eatin this stuff on all your hikes huh? wow j, that's just crazy!
Pretty sure GU contains caffeine too.

no actually I almost never take it on hikes, but I think I will. I've been just taking it sometimes with my cardio workouts, which, at 90-95% of my max heartrate, tend to be a bit painful and I don't mind the slight lessening of RPE.

does it make you hike faster? research suggests possibly it does.

Other things that make you hike faster:

1) Eating carbohydrates beforehand (carb loading)
2) Hydration
3) Proper concentration of electrolytes
4) Sleep
5) Exercise
6) Low Weight / Heart size ratio

You'll obviously do some of these things that 'enhance' your performance. So what's inherently wrong with caffeine, a natural ingredient?

And except for competitive athletes, no one optimizes all performance enhancing things, so what does it matter?

[FIGHT ON]

no actually I almost never take it on hikes, but I think I will.

I'll keep that in mind!:lol:

I've been just taking it sometimes with my cardio workouts, which, at 90-95% of my max heartrate, tend to be a bit painful and I don't mind the slight lessening of RPE.

You don't take this pain as a sign? maybe some indication that you would want to be aware of? Why mask it? don't you want to know what's really going on in your body? That would make me wonder weather I was overworking my heart and not knowing it.

does it make you hike faster? research suggests possibly it does.

The way you write this cracks me up! "suggests possibly it does."? Dude! it's a stimulant. Your heart does beat faster, each and every beat is stronger. What do you think is going to happen? Less blood to your cardio system, muscles etc?

Other things that make you hike faster:

1) Eating carbohydrates beforehand (carb loading)
2) Hydration
3) Proper concentration of electrolytes
4) Sleep
5) Exercise
6) Low Weight / Heart size ratio

You'll obviously do some of these things that 'enhance' your performance. So what's inherently wrong with caffeine, a natural ingredient?

None of these are drugs. None stimulants. so you can't group them with caffeine.
But because caffeine is a drug, and a stimulant, it can be grouped with other drugs and stimulants, including cocaine. After all, it's a natural ingredient too right! Imagine what you could do with that! I hear you can go for days and days and not need any of the 6 listed!

And except for competitive athletes, no one optimizes all performance enhancing things, so what does it matter?

Not sure what you mean here.
I'm just surprised how may users there are.
And how it's use is justified. Fascinating!!

[bluerail]

I know who the cairn kicker is....I just brought it up cause when I'm out there vibrating from stimulants, it's one thing I enjoy doing.

....I'm just shootin for a little comic relieve here buddy.

[lilbitmo]

In case it's not been pointed out - Fight On

All food, water, things consumed by the human body are "Drugs" - all of them (they all have a chemical base), the body changes the "Chemical Make Up" of them with it's own "Drugs/Chemicals" so that the body can use them for whatever purpose they were intended for. Some, like "Cocaine, Heroine, metaphetamies, etc... are obviously bad for the human body when abused - unless administered for "Surgery" or the proper uses.

Why are you always taking the side that people are doing something bad or cheating the "True nature of hiking" or "Sporting" activities, just because you "Choose not to enjoy them". If you want people to know you are a "Purest", just say so? For that matter don't eat any food, don't wear any clothing, don't put on a backpack, don't use hiking poles, don't use boots, don't go off the trail, don't ever wonder into private property, don't do anything but go on the "Blog Site" and badger what others are doing?

Growing up there was this saying that most people respected - "If you don't have something nice to say about someone, don't say it"! If you don't agree with something that's fine, just state the reason why that doesn't work for you, not why others are "Wrong for Doing it"

Most of the people here are looking for "Help" with getting to the great outdoors, doing it safely, reporting what great experiences they have had on a particular hike, who they ran into, what things to look out for, what conditions that have changed, where they can get permits, park, enter the wilderness, etc... etc... ect... if they wanted to debate every last thing they do before, during and after their hikes they would make a "Blog site for HIKING POLITICIANS"

Please by all means "Start your own website" - call it - "Hiking Purest, that only do what I think is right, of Los Angeles" I'm sure it will get an extensive amount of participation, and not much hiking will be done.

Sorry in advance for bagging, but it get's old reading the same banter on every post.

[KathyW]

Thanks for the good article Ellen.

Fighton: You have already expressed your opinion that you do not think it is good to ingest caffeine when hiking; so now it's time to move on to another subject. We don't need to have you continue to reinforce how "good and perfect" you are because you don't ingest caffeine. Maybe you need this type of reinforcement, but I don't think other people that frequent this message board do.

GU is a brand name - some varieties have caffeine and others do not.

KathyW: Maybe you overlooked some of the content of Z's post or for that matter all together.
I'm sure some of his comments were directed toward mine and invited a response.

Because you don't like or disagree with someones views on administrating stimulants/drugs should not be used as tool to limit responses.

That would be unfair.

And if you feel less than "good and perfect" because you take stimulants or of my views, I feel sorry for you.

Fighton:I don't care if people eat caffeine or do not, and you have no idea if I ingest caffeine. I find some of the research on caffeine interesting, so I appreciate Ellen sharing it with us. Generally, I do not mind people having an opinion that differs than mine (and you have no idea if my opinion on caffeine differs from yours), but I abhor self-righteous people that try to cram their opinion down other people’s throats. I also realize I should not lower myself to your level by responding to you, but I am anyway. Hopefully, in the future I will be able to just ignore you.