Young Hikers Missing in Joshua Tree Since Thursday [7/27/17]

[Ric Capucho]

Hi All,

Orbeso made a reference on social media last year that he’d acquired a 1981 Ruger New Model Super Blackhawk .44 handgun. Look it up, it’s quite the cannon. About three pounds in weight, depending on the barrel length.

“Ruger recommends the New Model Super Blackhawk for big game hunting.” Erm, quite. Not something a golf course security guard would use unless it’s to stop elephants trampling all over the putting greens. So unlikely to have been a purchase for his profession.

Assuming he didn’t have a collection of handguns, and the Blackhawk is indeed the weapon:

Wouldn’t the willingness to carry an extra three pounds of weight be better served by taking a *lot* more water?

Why would anyone bring such a cannon on a hike? Target practice? Is that why they went off trail?

Why would anyone in an extreme situation keep on carrying a three pound lump of steel in his backpack? Even if it was a lighter handgun (say 1.5 pounds) wouldn’t anyone in such dire straits ditch the extra weight?

Ric

[cynthia23]

That's a fascinating detail, Ric.

Here's a link to a KMIR video of Orbeso's family
http://www.kmir.com/story/36648617/excl ... -suffering

Very understandably, they are insisting it was a 'mercy' killing and a 'sympathetic' murder-suicide (??). In the text of the story, they say that Orbeso killed Nguyen 'when he realized no one was coming'. Also, the mother implies that she thinks her son died about five days after they were lost.

That idea seems implausible to me. I wasn't in JTNP of course, but given how large the search was, if they WERE still alive at the time the search commenced, surely they would have heard the helicopters buzzing around and garnered hope from that. They were not really that far from the trail or civilization and would not have a real reason to think 'no one is coming'. This isn't a case of people shipwrecked on an island in the Pacific and enduring weeks of suffering. As Ed says, would a rational person commit suicide after only being lost for a day?

But perhaps he was not rational. To be fair--heat stroke, perhaps combined with some usage of drugs, could have engendered an irrational despair, or a hallucinatory belief that they'd been out there for days (as opposed to hours), and brought about an irrational conviction that the only solution was murder-suicide.

Still, as Ric has pointed out, this doesn't really answer the question of why Orbeso chose to bring along a large gun, which was so conveniently to hand when this moment of despair arose.

[cynthia23]

I had heard taking mushrooms at JTNP was a 'thing' and a few minutes ago, I googled 'taking mushrooms at Joshua Tree." Try it. 97,000 hits, all puns intended. You betcha it's a thing. There are dozens and dozens of posts and discussions of how/where to do it.

I'm not saying they were necessarily under the influence during the hike, but given Orbeso's mention of 'shrooms' in his posts, and what they found at the AirBnB, it seems quite likely, and it would certainly explain some of what happened.

It's absolutely horrifying that so many people think this is a safe, or okay thing to do. Other than driving drunk, I can't think of anything more hazardous than taking mushrooms and going on a desert hike. You lose depth perception or a sense of time, you have visual hallucinations, and you experience irrational elation or panic. (I know. I've taken them, years ago.) I doubt, after all this time, if the coroner would be able to determine if they had ingested anything, but it would be helpful if he could, as it might dissuade people from doing mushrooms at JTNP in the future. Given this apparently common behavior, it's absolutely a miracle no one has died before now.

[cynthia23]

https://matadornetwork.com/nights/thoug ... nal-parks/

Just one example of the propaganda promoting this colossal stupidity.

[Ed]

Orbeso made a reference on social media last year that he’d acquired a 1981 Ruger New Model Super Blackhawk .44 handgun. Look it up, it’s quite the cannon. About three pounds in weight, depending on the barrel length.

Reminds me of Rooster Cogburn's comments on Mattie Ross's firearm in True Grit. Very few of the guns in this country are owned for practical reasons. Some men simply love to collect the hardware, like some women love to collect shoes.

[zippetydude]

I'm kind of disgusted that the media went pounding on the doors of the family members to get a story out of their personal tragedy. That is no longer news, it is just ugly. Imagine the poor families getting the news, feeling shocked and horrified yet again, and then having reporters with cameras and microphones in your face wanting to make a story out of what you're going through. Disgusting.

z

[cynthia23]

That's certainly my personal response, but bear in mind that people have the choice of whether or not to talk. Nguyen's family hasn't spoken; Orbeso's has. For some people, speaking about their grief on TV, in a very public forum, may be cathartic and helpful and deeply comforting to them. I can't imagine it in a million years--I hate talking on camera--but people do differ dramatically in this respect. An argument could be made that these public interviews of grieving parents are basically the modern equivalent of ancient grieving practices like tearing your clothes and running down the street while wailing loudly, or having a funeral parade with a brass band and paid mourners--that they satisfy some deep need people have to share their grief with strangers and make a spectacle of themselves grieving. You and I Zip, find it inconceivable, but I suspect we're INTP types.

As for the question of why people watch TV spectacles of grieving--well, again, they make me uncomfortable to the point I change the channel, but perhaps for others, they satisfy some need to connect. Or, it's part of human preoccupation with threats and danger--trying to glean what they did wrong so I don't make that same mistake. Honestly, this entire thread is in a way based on that impulse. It's harder to be sympathetic toward people who just want to watch grieving people on TV but I think I can understand it from some kind of evolutionary perspective.

As for the reporters, of course, their only impulse is ratings.

[zippetydude]

Good points Cynthia. Two thoughts: Your instincts in this case prove that you would make a far better investigator than I would, as you seemingly knew from the start where this would go. You were not unkind in the way you brought the possibilities to mind, but you were (at least to a naive mind like mine who is kind of always set to the simplest "natural cause") far closer to the mark from day 1. Factoring the short time between disappearance and inability to contact or locate them was a clever intuitive leap that I did not make. As far as the "mercy" clause being set forth by the father, that is the reason I found the story disturbing at this point. What else could a parent say? "I guess my son was planning on a murder suicide, but I still love him despite his despicable crime?" Maybe just let the facts land and leave the poor heartbroken families out of it. No doubt his dad, his dedicated searching days and weeks later dad, feels terribly driven to find an honorable explanation. I don't blame him, I would do the same. But what if he were left alone, with no mics and cameras, and just allowed to process this impossibly hard loss without being thrust onto a stage. Just seems more appropriate to me.

z

[cynthia23]

Yeah, I hear you, it's a pathetic and distasteful spectacle. But I honestly think the father wants to do it, impossible though it would seem to us.

Sad, strange, terrible story.

[Wildhorse]

He may be speaking out to defend his son's honor and that of his family. The evidence in the desert was apparently only suggestive and could not reveal all that happened. The father's explanation sounds plausible even though subject to doubt. He knew his son, even if imperfectly.

The media is suggestive too, as usual. All for money.