Time to "FIX" the Skyline "trail"

[Hikin_Jim]

I think snow poles would be a little unsightly. You could put reflectors or other markers on trees -- such trees as there are. There aren't convenient trees everywhere. Someone put orange blobs on the rocks in the past, but people didn't like them and removed them. You could also improve the tread so that it would be a followable trail, which is what Rick suggested when he started this thread.

Those are some options. I know that making the route more trail like or putting up markers will meet with opposition. I rather enjoy route finding myself. However, in light of the fact that people are getting into serious trouble there and our SAR guys are having to take a lot of risks, maybe marking the route a little bit better isn't too much to ask.

There isn't any solution that will make everyone happy.

Also, no matter what we do, there will always be accidents on Skyline, just because of it's physical nature. 8000' over 11 miles if I remember correctly. Ice in late fall, winter, and early spring. High heat in the hot months. Some people who have done hiking in relatively easy terrain have no idea what 8000 feet of gain really means. "It's only 11 miles, and there's beer at the top, and I can just ride the tram down. How bad can it be?" A lot of people really don't know what it's like to hike in 100+ heat. "I've hiked in the Summer before; I'll be fine." Still, perhaps we can help enough to make a difference.

[Cy Kaicener]

Nothing much will change until this is recognised as an official trail or route. There are pros and cons for and against. (Now thats playing it safe )

[asabat]

There have been discussions here and elsewhere (PCT-L every spring) about better marking the trails on San Jacinto. Some (including myself) believe individuals should be knowledgable and prepared to find their own way, and that multiple trail posts, blazes, and flags detract from the experience. Others believe that anything that can be done to prevent injury and death is worthwhile and should be done. The problem is that no matter what is done, someone will always find a way to get lost, injured, or die, even if we install handrails the entire distance and make you go with someone who will hold your hand. In any event, posts and blazes cannot be installed in the wilderness except with the authority of the authorities. My fear is if too many people ask them to do this, they will just shut some places down.

A friend did the Devils Slide Trail to Saddle Junction this weekend and said the rangers were turning around anyone without snowshoes or crampons. In spite of that, he said three of his friends did slip about 50 feet in one spot along the trail.

[AlanK]

Some (including myself) believe individuals should be knowledgable and prepared to find their own way, and that multiple trail posts, blazes, and flags detract from the experience. Others believe that anything that can be done to prevent injury and death is worthwhile and should be done. The problem is that no matter what is done, someone will always find a way to get lost, injured, or die, even if we install handrails the entire distance and make you go with someone who will hold your hand. In any event, posts and blazes cannot be installed in the wilderness except with the authority of the authorities. My fear is if too many people ask them to do this, they will just shut some places down.

The situation with Skyline is this: There is a path (I will avoid "trail") from Palm Springs to within a few hundred vertical feet of Long Valley that can be followed by a blind novice (assuming non-winter conditions). The last section is harder to follow and it seems that people get lost there with some regularity. We then get situations in which tired, lost hikers find themselves 10+ miles and 1500" vertical feet from their start, with neither the resources nor the desire to descend into the standard Palm Springs heat. Such situations are recipes for disaster.

As much as I like primitive routes and route-finding, it seems obvious that some simple changes here could save lives and perhaps keep authorities from working to shut down a favorite route.

[Hikin_Jim]

As much as I like primitive routes and route-finding, it seems obvious that some simple changes here could save lives and perhaps keep authorities from working to shut down a favorite route.

Well, that's a really good point. A few simple improvements along one stretch of the route is a small price to pay for keeping the authorities at bay.

The problem is that no matter what is done, someone will always find a way to get lost, injured, or die, even if we install handrails the entire distance ...

Ack! Don't say things like that!

[asabat]

As much as I like primitive routes and route-finding, it seems obvious that some simple changes here [the last section] could save lives and perhaps keep authorities from working to shut down a favorite route.

This is an interesting conundrum, in that, as I understand it, the top of the Skyline has been deliberately kept obscure to keep tourons coming off the tram from coming across it and deciding to "see where it goes" only to get themselves in trouble.

Maybe a couple ducks in key spots, very obvious from the below but hidden from above?

[Rick M]

asabat, in discussions I've had with other people about this, this is one of the things we considered. If the Skyline is fixed to withen say 200' of the top that might prevent topside "tourists" from stumbling on it. One of the problems with that is the exit point of the Skyline is a convenient place for these people to walk over and take a look at the valley below and with all the traffic of the Skyline hikers (and rescue personel) the area is beginning to look "well visited". I have suggested trying to move the exit point to a location (rocky nearby area so as to not look like a trail). These are things that need to be considered and addressed for the "FIX".

[zippetydude]

Hey, while you're busy fixing Skyline, please remove all the rattlers. Thank you.

z

[cynthia23]

I am not opposed to the rattlers, but I would strongly prefer there to be a working espresso cart in operation at Flat Rock. Latte, anyone?

While we are waiting for that, I think I tend to agree that some markers on those sections above Flat Rock that give the Marines so much trouble, are not a bad idea. Perhaps we should nail beer cans to the trees? "This way to the giant kegger in the sky, folks?"

[Hikin_Jim]

Hey, while you're busy fixing Skyline, please remove all the rattlers. Thank you.

z

Finally! Something we can all agree on!
(Especially since you gave Ellen your snake chaps)