Snow on Skyline?

[robpollard]

Perry,
What a nice thing to offer. And you gave your number out on a public board too.
I usually only make one or two trips to San Jacinto a year, but when I do, I hope I run into you.

Rob

[billc]

Perry et al

Thanks for the offer of the ice axe! I think that may be a bit too tempting due to general lack of knowledge of how to use it (self-arrest, etc), lack of crampons, & not wanting to tempt fate, me relying on my pal for a ride.... We just won't proceed ahead if it looks too dangerous. I got a nice primer on what "too dangerous" looks like hiking on Baldy 2 weeks ago. Got plenty of water >1 gallon each, plus gatorade & snacks. As far as the confirmation posting - I see your point, though I've already dug the hole a bit...so will attempt a rather prompt post after the return. Hopefully with some helpful info for folks going up in the next few weeks.

[guest]

Hey folks,
Did Skyline today, hopefully convinced a few ill-prepared on trail today to not go all the way.
Snow doesn't start until the Traverse (well into trees approx. 7,900 ft?).
But, it's steep here, exposed, and hard-packed snow.
You NEED cramp-ons and some experience to do it.
Very few prints to follow, about 50& coverage, the patches are long & big enough as not be unable to follow trail unless you Know it, and unable to completely avoid the snow..
I used my ax from about there on.
If your very strong, very fit & have energy left after Coffman's Crag (the big-ass Rock face you need to head for before heading wast again), you can keep off most snow by literally going almost straight up.
BUT, to get to that point, you need cramp-ons & ax, it's definitely not worth risking it without.
Temps were nice, no rattlers but a few Whip-snakes (garter), lots of flowers.

ss

[Torben Thomsen]

I just came back from the top section of Skyline.

Took the Tram up at 1:30PM and walked down to the beginning of the traverse with crampons and ice ax. This time the snow was soft so you could easily kick steps into it. Like "guest" reported there is only snow on about 50% of the trail. On the way back up, I removed my crampons and walked without difficulty.

Based on that experience, I would consider Skyline open for the season. But I would advise that ONLY experienced hikers who thoroughly know the trail attempt the upper section. For others it is very easy to get lost and into trouble.

I also did some initial surveying of another potential route to the top. While doing that I recovered a lost cell phone [Casio-Verizon in a blue AWP belt clip cover] and a red climbing rope. Those appeared connected to a fall some time ago. When I find out the owner of the phone, I will report the story behind it. Hopefully there is not a dead body up there.

[billc]

Thanks for all the advice - we're off.

[Perry]

You need crampons. You don't need crampons. It's a grey situation right now. Maybe in a couple weeks it will be "just a hike."

To clarify, back in February I would not offer an ice axe or crampons to somebody with little experience, as the solid ice doesn't give an opportunity to practice without fatal consequences.

[Rick M]

"guest" climbed it and said you "NEED" crampons and used his/her ice axe. I don't know what time of day that was but Torben then said on the same day he used crampons and axe going down then was able to go back up kicking steps in the softened snow of the afternoon (different skill levels or amount of acceptable risk ???) . We get called out allot when people start hitting the snow late afternoon/evening when it starts freezing back up and becomes hard and slick. I would say while there is snow it is best to have axe and crampons (& skill)...if no crampons think about
A) cutting a lot of steps with axe but make sure you know how to arrest a fall
B) turn around and go back down
C) wait until the snow is gone

I've seen people kill and injured trying to just kick steps and slip.

my 2 cents

ps I've loaned many of my axes to both friends and new SAR people to use for practice in "relatively safe" areas as well. People have four options for this:
A) buy one and hope for the best
B) rent one and hope for the best (cheaper)
C) borrow one from a friend and hope some instruction/practice comes with
D) pay big bucks to some school and maybe do better than "option C"

options A & B are the worst, C is the best if the instruction is good because you then meet people and have friends that you can go with to hone your newly acquired skill. I don't recommend option D because I've seen too many people do this and come away thinking they can conquer the world and get themselves in trouble on their own. Also, I helped train two guys who said their big bucks class showed them how to use trekking poles cause the instructor said "that's the way to go".

again, my two cents

[billc]

we're back. did not go all the way to the tram but rather turned around at "flat rocks" 5800' due to slower-than-expected time and concerns about ice near the top. So unfortunately, no further insight as to snow situation. Thanks again to all who posted replies. It sure doesn't LOOK from below like there is a lot of snow below the tram so it would have been tempting to go up if not for all the informative discussion. Looking back it was a good decision. Did see 1 rattlesnake at about 5 PM at the painted rocks near the picnic table.

[Perry]

It sure doesn't LOOK from below like there is a lot of snow below the tram so it would have been tempting to go up if not for all the informative discussion.

Very true. It's deceptive. Even a few weeks ago when it was more dangerous, it probably looked like just a little bit of snow, but the trees hide the traverse at 7,800' to 8,000' and especially the final climb to Long Valley (8,400') is well-shaded.

[kellie]

Wow - you guys just keep impressing me! Thanks so much for your contributions to the subject and for giving those of us that don't live close by a better idea of what to expect when we get there! Please continue to update us as folks get closer to completing a "hike" along Skyline. I'm looking forward to hiking it again this year, but want to make sure I'm also being careful...

Thanks again and looking forward to hearing what the next few weeks bring us!