C2C Oct/Nov - Skyline questions

[Sally]

amongtheclouds, I think the get-together is still on for Sat. Oct 11, but it looks like a small gathering. However, those attending are some of our finest and you will enjoy talking about Skyline with them. It turns out I have to work that day so I won't be in attendance. Keep checking the thread on that topic.
In my opinion Bear Canyon is one of the best training grounds for Skyline. I, too, am bummed that it is closed.

[amongtheclouds]

Hah! That was my initial thought after the first time on Bear Canyon: "You know, this is perfect for C2C/Skyline training". Kicker was the forecasts were wrong that day (75 degrees) and it ended up a scorching and sunny 95 degrees, but made it through. Very bummed it got closed. It's the only way I like to go besides Register Ridge. Called them a day before I was going to set out on the 20 mile Baldy Big Loop and learned of the closure news. Scrapped those plans pretty fast.

I'll keep a lookout on the meetup details, thanks! Hadn't noticed there were 4 pages, only noticed the first page.

[63ChevyII]

Really dig that trail map and the step by step, 63ChevyII. ...Very comprehensive map compared to a SoCal Hiker one I found.

Thanks! The SoCal Hiker one is an earlier version (I made both). Do you carry a GPS unit?

If you're in Palms Springs the night before, hiking up to the picnic tables or to the junction with the large cairn (if starting at Ramon Road), wouldn't be a bad idea. The first 3 times I hiked Skyline, we started at the museum and got 'lost' each time, losing 15-30 mins. One afternoon we were in Palm Springs for a parade, so I dropped my wife and kid off and hiked from Ramon Road to the cairn... I haven't started at the museum since!

Will you post here before your hike, when you finally pick a date?

I like to watch sunrise from the 4300 ft marker. The last time we hiked Skyline, we were slower than expected and ended up watching it just above Rescue 1.
Skyline Trip Report, March 29 2014

[Ed]

The first 3 times I hiked Skyline, we started at the museum and got 'lost' each time, losing 15-30 mins.

If you think that's bad, I started down the trail to Ramon Road my second time.

[63ChevyII]

The first 3 times I hiked Skyline, we started at the museum and got 'lost' each time, losing 15-30 mins.

If you think that's bad, I started down the trail to Ramon Road my second time.

LOL, I did that the 3rd and last time I started at the museum. That's the time we lost 30 mins!

[guest]

Howdy amongtheclouds,

Really glad your doing your homework on this undertaking, (looks like you have the right sunglasses too!). It sounds like you'll do just fine, if all in your group are trained up. I like to have a bailout point, 3-4k works well, so if anyone is having a bad day, they can turn around, and not have to down climb from 5 or 6k, (not fun at all!), but egos get in the way at times.

Ramon is easier, a bit farther, but worth it, since the Museum is a mess, (yes, as Bluerail mentioned, just go up, but it can be frustrating, especially in the dark).
Once past the painted rock sign jct., I would pause at each minor junction (false trail, short-cut, new trail v original), and attempt to see where it heads. Taking every steep "new trail" can take it's toll, especially on a C2C attempt. These steep, and a bit shorter trails save little time if any, (unless your super fit & know the route), and can take much of the fun out of the rest of your climb.

You mentioned booking it after a certain point; I'd suggest to just stay steady. If you've ever done a marathon, or something similar, it's tempting to hammer when feeling strong, but this can bite you as you may use up some of your needed reserves for later on, (of course, I've never done this.....ha).

Keep you body fueled & hydrated, (you know this), but it needs to be stressed, and remind your buds too, or someone may become an anchor for the group.

You should have approx. 11 hrs of daylight early Nov, and I like to allow 12-14 hrs. for c2c, so I'd say a 3-4am start should be plenty, if your all fit & keep a decent pace, w/out too many breaks. You don't want to finish in the dark, tired, cold & stumbling around.

Pay attention in the trees past 7k, as there are a few areas to get off, where the route either crosses one of the gullies, or where it switches-back on itself.

Doing a "recon" of the whole Museum tr can make your legs tired for the morning, (especially the down-climb).

Have a great climb, and glad your taking the time & effort to take on this challenge in a responsible way!

ss

[Ed]

LOL, I did that the 3rd and last time I started at the museum. That's the time we lost 30 mins!

Confession is good for the soul, isn't it?

[amongtheclouds]

Hey all, thanks again for all of the details and suggestions. We ended up attempting C2C yesterday, we had a schedule opening this weekend and the temp trends were holding below the forecasts. I say "attempt" because I got 1 mile from the summit and had to turn back - the light was dimming, my pace had slowed enough that the timing math was questionable, I became a little low on food (water was more than fine), didn't want to cut it too close for the last tram (hence the timing math), and for whatever reason my gut instinct told me to call it for what it was and descend - not sure in hindsight if it truly was my better judgement or my body gave up. My mind still wanted to succeed. It ended up just being me alone after the Mountain Station. My hiking partner and I got through Skyline and once up there, he wasn't feeling too good despite hydrating and eating the whole time. I suspected early AMS based on his symptoms, he insisted I go on, and I made sure he got to the tram for a ride down and that he was all-good. We stayed in touch and he's all fine today, safe and sound, and felt back to normal by the time he reached the bottom of the tram - after that it was just general exhaustion. So, C2C was left incomplete but everyone made it back just fine. Here's some of my thoughts and observations from the trip:

- I didn't find Skyline that hard at all. A long and sustained slog yes, but not anywhere near what it's been advertised and warned about, though I don't say this self-righteously. I honestly believe this reaction to Skyline I had owes to my preparedness level both fitness and having done ample homework ahead of time.

- Route finding also wasn't hard. We caught onto the subtle clues pretty quick, whether human-maintained (thanks!) or naturally-occurring, and got off-trail maybe 3 times, each only about 30 sec before realizing our error. Usually we re-traced and realized we missed a switchback. The climb above the traverse was easy to stay on-route. On Friday I slowly day-hiked up to the picnic tables and painted rocks from the Museum for a bit of recon - glad I did so that I'd know to say the "right" at the double-arrow and not end up downhill. That's the route we took, and we got the painted rocks quickly. We never felt lost up there.

- Skyline took us about 8h20m total, though we took two leisurely breaks (our time probably closer to 7h30m if we kept those shorter). We began around 3:30 am, reached the painted rocks just before 4 am, Rescue #1 about 4:50 am, just above 4,300 by actual sunrise (6:50 am), Rescue #2 about 8:30 am, Coffman's Crag about 11:20 am (our longest break was at Flat Rock - couldn't resist the shade and breeze) . No creatures to be seen on or around the trail (expect for the 10 min of sunrise mosquitoes!). A few others were out on the trail too starting before and after us.

- My hiking partner was comfortable the whole time and we kept pretty good pace. As a solo I might have moved just a touch quicker, but we were fine - except when he topped out and wasn't feeling too well. We both got through Skyline safely and didn't feel concerned along the way. My (comfortable) hydration needs through Skyline were only 2L water + 1 Gatorade... though I hauled almost 6L of water. I know better now for next time.

- It was quite an unforgettable experience. Particularly the night-hiking, alpenglow bathing San J, and the unique topography - unlike any local LA-area mountains I've been in. On riding the tram down, I was floored by how much the gain was on Skyline. That ride really puts the hike into perspective that it's no small feat. I didn't take that many pictures though, was too focused on the ascent. I hope to have an opportunity again at some point to complete C2C from start to finish if it's meant to happen.

[tekewin]

Nice job! A lot of people stop at the station after Skyline and don't attempt the full C2C. It is a big day just to do Skyline.

I am surprised you didn't need more water. I went through 8 liters! The climate changes a lot from the bottom and there are plenty of things that can go wrong.

C2C is still the 2nd toughest hike I've done, after Whitney, but opinions differ on that score.

[Ed]

The water question, and the differing opinions expressed, are interesting. Obviously, water consumption should depend on temperature and body weight. I started out carrying 5 quarts, found I never drank more than 3-1/2, and now carry three, after drinking a quart on the drive to the trailhead. I'm a big sweater, weigh about 175 pounds, and have hiked the trail at PS lows / highs of up to 68 /95.